disallow mass games & remove old clutter

[pix]

1) don't allow servers on the list with more than 12 slots for players (no limit on spectators, would need code changes ofc) or alternatively, for now, just a hard limit of 24 clients

   a) this can be improved by setting max player count per mode: effic/insta/ffa: limit of 8, team modes: limit of 12

   b) only exceptions are matches that will attract a lot of attention like tournaments, but those have to be whitelisted with eihruk (or whoever might be running the masterserver in the future) like 3 weeks in advance

2) trim down the map pool in sauer, clean up the whole /packages/ directory, maybe even drop support for certain modes

[swatllama]

I like the idea, pix! Or in other words,
DEATH TO CROWD

[bandandit]

Nice idea pix.
Streamlining the master list and limiting the number of players on servers might produce more active servers and maybe even more modes being played.
Not a fan of dropping support of modes, even though we all know there are some serious failed ones out there.

[vzzec]

Nice idea bro! Usually i can only choose between Demophobia with 34players on and some venice server with 40players on...And i think its no secret that the maps in sauer are not made for such a huge amount of players. Hm 14slots for a public server would be fine (Calm park rules!). Seriously, if i do more tks than frags on Demophobia just coz my sight is completely blocked by shiploads of teammates...Well i should stop here before i rage again.
Keep up the good work man, i look forward for more ideas.

[frosty]

I think a cleanup release would be swell. There are more maps than people are bothered to even look at and by removing the clutter the game could become lightweight. Also I think there is a way to have more clients than the maxclients value if some of the connected players are in spec mode..?

[star]

I see a problem with your numbers.
12 clients on a server are about 4 specators in a 4v4, that's nonsens to me.
I agree that huge servers running ICTF are bananas, Still venice is a server that's only fun with >24 players.
The crowd server is ofc stupid, no reason to argue there.

[pix]

I see a problem with your numbers.
12 clients on a server are about 4 specators in a 4v4, that's nonsens to me.

You didn't understand what I wrote. I suggested having a player limit of 12 PLUS unlimited specs, that limits teams to 6 players. Until something like this can be implemented, a temporary fix would be to only allow a maximum of 24 clients (players + specs).

[swatllama]

Pix, 12 players (6v6) doesn't seem very good for a lot of maps, like hallo, or europium. PSL usually has what, 18-20? Somewhere around there is pretty comfortable for most players. 16 at the lowest, I guess.

As you know, Frosty, I like the idea of trimming out some maps, maybe putting in some more maps that eihrul idiotically overlooked to somewhat-replace them. It muust be daunting for new players to come on and see 40 ctf maps to choose from. "Hey, xenon looks cool, let's vote that" --> Lower gameplay value.
DEATH TO CROWD

[Quality]

I like the idea, though new players who maybe aren't good yet (= noobs) rather would want to play on bigger servers, I guess than on (closed?) games with the "competitive players". It might become frustrating to them. If it will be implemented really really nicely, I would love it.

[bandandit]

I like the idea, though new players who maybe aren't good yet (= noobs) rather would want to play on bigger servers, I guess than on (closed?) games with the "competitive players". It might become frustrating to them. If it will be implemented really really nicely, I would love it.

Perhaps you're right. Limit the number of slots and inexperienced players are just going to get frustrated up against even a small number of veteran fraggers.

This may need a separate thread but what about some sort of auto balance script (at least during map load) based on server rank to help eliminated one sided pwnage? I know that it won't be completely accurate based on one's time spent in a particular server but it's better than nothing. Maybe there's a way to set certain perameters for rank other than frag count?

[Suicizer]

Unlike killing the mass servers completely; Sauerbraten could rather use a different set up when it comes to servers appearing first in the list.
Currently the highest priority is:
- Most players
then if equal amount;
- Best ping

But if it would be:
- Best ping
then if equal amount;
- Most players

The amount of players should get lower as that's not the highest priority.
The remaining play time could also be involved; why would you join a server if there's only 1 minute to play left?
So perhaps:
- Best ping
- Remaining play time
- Most players
Would work best; as it's even more rare servers have the exact same remaining play time and also an identical ping rate.

A ranking system is pretty unlikely to be included as that takes a lot effort for a problem Eihrul doesn't care.

[Alu]

that does not seem a brilliant idea, he just spoke the obvious

popo as demophobia prevents the game can be improved

someone new, from some other fpsgame (potential competitive player) look at the list of servers and see 2 things

- Horrible servers filled to the brim

- Maybe one mixgame

....  /quit      :'v

[Suicizer]

I like the idea, though new players who maybe aren't good yet (= noobs) rather would want to play on bigger servers, I guess than on (closed?) games with the "competitive players". It might become frustrating to them. If it will be implemented really really nicely, I would love it.

I think they would rather be on a small server with less players so they get the time to  understand the gameplay of Sauerbraten and do the right move, then to brainlessly search for cover.
If they still can't handle the other players, they could go to another server instead due the lower maximum of players on each server.

[Ardelico]

Problem: instactf most popular mode
Problem: every little sauer whiner wants their ictf server to be on top

Solution: 1, and ONLY ONE, preset ictf server: psl.sauerleague.org or demophobia
Problem (with solution): all the whiners will cry they can't host ictf preset server.  Oh, you're insta expert? Do tell me, how you got your ass kicked in effic and ffa by just about every other person in sauer

Profit: other modes will be played.  Keep the ictf server at max 15-20 clients, or even 12 as suggested.  Thus others will play other gamemodes.  People will realize that effic is more entertaining that insta. 
"oh but people will just src mod and host ictf" - well thats why any and all ictf that isnt demo or psl is banned from master server.

You can claim admin and change to ictf on your server, but your server can't be set to ictf by default with locked maprotation.  All in all, ban ICTF on ALL servers BUT demo/psl, while allowing server admin to change mode if they want a private ictf clan war or something.  But no more mass public ICTF!  DEATH TO ICTF! 


Problem 2: all the damn modded servers.
Solution: hide and seek: gtfo, zombie server: gtfo, race servers: gtfo  (now if they are actual modes added in release, thats another story, but now they are mods)

Overall Profit:
1 ictf server
no modded servers, no bullcrap
=
more gamemodes played
=
more skilled players, bigger SSL's
=
more fun sauer

"But ICTF is fun!" - yeah, if holding W and spamming space key is 'fun'
"But racing is fun!" - ^
"But zombie mode is fun!" - You just play it because it's slow gamespeed and you get a lot of kills, but on any other server you cry and r/q when you get killed once.
"But hide and seek is fun!" - I won't say anything bad because i do enjoy it every now and then, but still, bad!


I mean, Alu just said it all.

that does not seem a brilliant idea, he just spoke the obvious

popo as demophobia prevents the game can be improved

someone new, from some other fpsgame (potential competitive player) look at the list of servers and see 2 things

- Horrible servers filled to the brim

-Maybe one mixgame

....  /quit   :'v

[Terminator]

This is pretty much all we need to know:

Problem: instactf most popular mode

I utterly agree with you Ardelico.

P.S: Sorry for the other reply, I didn´t want to write it.